Joker vs. American History X



Love Joker but for now I’m taking the Classic.

Joker for me, I felt Norton was overacting for most of the movie.


Two great movies with two great leading performances . American History X is slightly favored here.

White Male Rage vs White Male Rage gotta go for American History X.

Joker wins this one. I would like American History X if it was a lot more subtle


A subtle movie about racism?

American History X wins...

White men are idiots.

What I mean by 'subtle' is that it can express a message without anyone being gruesomely rape in the shower for shock value. Dunno, maybe it's just a personal thing but I found the entire tone of the movie to be distasteful and off putting for the sake of being distasteful and giving a heavy handed yet obvious message about racism. It doesn't help that the filmmaking looked somewhat cheap and inconsistent at that.

Although I did liked AHX, I understand your point. It actually looks very cheap, idk, like a soap opera. But what I think I really liked was how it's kind of crude. That being said, I don't think it'll really hold up on a second viewing when I stop to think about it.


American History X improves on a second viewing. I love the Joker and think it is close to perfect but American History X earns more respect with every viewing. Will Joker hold up? Time will tell.

Joker is NOT a good movie. Let me say it again, Joker is NOT a good movie. American History X, however, is because it cared enough to have an actual script and storyline.

Joker flat out sucked but on the other hand American History X is another good level film.

"White men are idiots." Whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's not forget the women and children too. After all, it's 2020; we need to be more inclusive and equitable with our cheap racism.

Because the whiteys are such an oppressed race, am I right? Oh, how white men struggled through the ages because of racism and sexism!

The irony of inadvertently straw-manning your own dumbass argument. Oof. Arraigning the implicitly racist claim that "white men are idiots" =/= supporting the claim that "*whiteys* have not, historically, been the benefactors of systemic group power struggles". Even the second, slightly more reasonable claim (which you've also somehow managed to undergird in racist stupidity), can be deconstructed with a couple of simple history, civics and economics lessons. But, then, that would probably require a temperate mind and the ability to read well, which, experience tells me, are not often two traits that racist, identitarian types are blessed with.

Just a minute. You're really talking about "reverse racism" here? Of course generalizing that white men are idiots is a dumb claim because they're not all idiots. It just seems to me that you're easily offended by a random comment by a random person on internet times. If you couldn't get it, I didn't mean it. I don't think all white men are idiots; some are, some aren't. Same thing with black people, women, LGBT, Christians, any social group will have a quotient of idiots. I just didn't thought (straight) white men (as I guess you are) were "easily offended", as they say they're not. Anyway, there's no such thing as being racist with white people, let's get it clear. You just shouldn't judge nobody by skin color, sex, creed or sexual orientation. Unless you're some dumb white supremacist incel, I think you should agree with me here.

Offended? Loooooool! No, no, be more offensive. I think you’re hoping I’m offended as subterfuge; a distraction from the actual substance. Go balls deep, fam. 'Reverse Racism' (in the way you're mistakenly trying to define it) is a moot term, redundant by definition. It's just racism. Again, by definition. And that's to say nothing of the historical suffering of an entire array of white peoples (who, yes, represent a wide variety of *different* peoples - plural - unless you take an Anglocentric position, which would also be bigoted in its own way), nor the swathes of white people living in relative poverty in both the developed and developing world. "Whiteness" is not a homogenous bloc (faulty premise). One only need compare, say, Bosnia to Russia, or Armenia (and the, oh, you know, genocide) to Canada/U.S.A. Yeah, I'm not even slightly offended. I'm not offended when people posit self-contradictory ideas, anti-intellectualism, and hypocrisy, and then pretend to own the moral high ground in order to preserve their sense of victimhood. I just find the lack of weight mildly amusing. I'm also not white. You shouldn't assume my race (nor my sexuality). That, I'm told, is also borderline bigoted. Something, something microaggression. Irrespective, neither my race, nor whether or not I'm offended is in any way relevant to the actual content of the discussion. Whether I'm offended/not or white/not isn't pertinent. "Anyway, there's no such thing as being racist with white people, let's get it clear." Stated as fact, yet disguising an opinion that goes against the actual facts. "You just shouldn't judge nobody by skin color..." Yes, you should try to follow your own claims. "Unless you're some dumb white supremacist incel, I think you should agree with me here." Except you’re not even agreeing with yourself. This is basically a 'No true Scotsman' fallacy with a bunch of ad hominems and loaded language thrown in to paper over the cracks. You're essentially being prejudiced and then making the sleight of hand claim that 'unless you agree with me that prejudice is bad, you are prejudiced'. Like, layers. Layers of moralising, dumbass hypocrisy. You also shouldn’t project what (you think) some other white people claim about having thick skin onto other individual white people. If I were white and offended, I might point out that that’s called stereotyping. As it happens, I’m not, so let me just point out that you’re a dumbass and then thank you for the humorous distraction today. Also, the correct usage up there would have been “think”, not “thought” (two finite verbs).

Umm... so... what about this weather today?

Well, let me tell you something about climate change... I'M KIDDING, I'M KIDDING!

Loooool @Caesar. Noice. Very noice.