Captain America: The First Avenger vs. Batman Begins

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53 comments

Batman Begins is flawed and, frankly, Nolanites are so in denial about that fact. The reason a lot of people like Batman Begins is because it followed the awful Batman & Robin and set up the exceptional TDK. On it's own, Batman Begins is on the lower end of the scale, not bad but not even close to a film as good as Captain America. Cap is an exceptional film in most every way.

Batman Begins is vastly superior to CA for one major reason: BB has fantastic character development, or in this case, ANY CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT AT ALL!!! I'm sorry, but the former Human Torch did NOT give this character anything in the way of depth. Captain America is, quite possibly, the most stagnant titular character in the history of origin films, comic book or otherwise. A glorified steroid injection does not develop anything but muscles. Batman Begins, on the other hand, not only had Bruce go through a great change from the start of the film, but made that journey layered and complex and gave it the proper time to develop properly without feeling rushed or contrived (i.e. Thor). Combine that with a vastly superior supporting cast and villain (Neeson squashes Weaving) and Batman still holds up as one of the greatest films of any genre.

In defence of Chris Evans, there's nothing he could've done to Capt. USA to bring him to life. He could've tried playing a 'different' character but he played Cap, and Cap is just a blah character.

Good God it's not even close. Captain America is a superior film. If a person really thinks that's character development in Batman Begins then they don't know what that term means. The plot and overall story of Batman Begins is not very good. The entire villain plot is flat out laughable. Plus, once Bruce puts the suit on and assumes the identity the movie spirals downward. Cap is an adventure film that builds and offers payoffs along the way. It features many tones unlike the dark monotone Begins. Evans trumps Bale and didn't have to use a "tough guy" gravel voice to do it. You believe the reason why Cap dresses as he does and is able to do superhuman things. The reason why Bruce dresses as a flying rodent and does what he does is ridiculous given the parameters of the movie. Steve Rogers has character to start the film and spends the running time defending and building upon those features. Did he change internally over the course of the film? No, that's the point. Did Indiana Jones change during Raiders of the Lost Ark?

Batman Begins is vastly superior because Bruce's transition from single minded vengeance to justice was complex, layered and took its time to have him go through the transition rather than just have him "get it", and it's far more engaging than any journey a Marvel character has gone through. Evans Cap is bland and one note, building on nothing except physical ability. Ghul's plot is no more ridiculous than Skull's, but Neeson's performance sells it better. Bruce's transition to Batman is handled extremely well and makes complete sense, not to mention the costume in general is much less laughable than Cap's. BB also has better dialogue and a much tighter script with less cliches, and doesn't have any massive plotholes, like the team breaking into a facility through the open windows of a supposedly "secure, underground base".

Without a doubt, Captain America The First Avengers destroys Batman Begins. Anyone saying otherwise must be a relative of Chris Nolan or Nolan himself.

Batman begins annihilates any film that the drastically overrated Marvel studios have ever put to screen, especially CA, which has a one dimensional lead, tons of bad cliches, and Tommy Lee Jones playing Tommy Lee Jones (just like in 99% of his films).

cap is half a great film, up unitl time change montage that film was well paced and enjoyable, then someone hit the fast forward button and it becomes a mess, does anyone remember who the fuck the howling commando's are? what's with bucky's random death? batman begins is slightly more enjoyable and doesn't have a stupid pace change halfway through it, loved both these film but the bat takes it just cause it's well, better

Whatever these Nolan disciples are smoking I'll pass on it. Cap wins this one rather easily. Captain America combines the thrills of a summer popcorn spectacular with the craftsmanship of a more ambitious picture. BB was good for getting Batman off the canvas after the franchise was knocked cold but it can't match the best of Marvel on it's best day. Just because Nolan has single-handedly kept the DC properties from being the complete laughingstock of the cinematic world doesn't mean we should judge Batman Begins higher because of what has followed from the WB.

Batman begins is a much stronger film than Cap for various reasons, the biggest being that its titular character is actually developed. I'm not saying all good movies have to have fleshed out, complex, rich characters to be good (i.e: 2001, Inception) but for a superhero ORIGIN film that's supposed to depict the journey of Steve Rogers, CA has less meat than a vegan platter. Plus, Cap has some incredibly stupid plot points, like the one where the government keeps Cap in the sidelines doing musicals when he is by far their best soldier. Yes, after pumping millions of dollars into this government project to create the perfect soldier and SUCCEEDING, they keep their best weapon on the sidelines because “There's not enough like him”, and please don't try to patronize me by saying 'They wanted to keep the formula away from the bad guys'. More soldiers would mean GREATER access to the chemical. It was nothing more than a contrived element to make Steve “prove” his worth, even though he already did by catching up to a Nazi soldier driving away on foot, and cram in an unnecessary action scene. Also, what kind of an idiot would infiltrate a Nazi base wearing a BIG FRIGGIN' AMERICAN SYMBOL like a bulls-eye on his back. It would have made more sense to take the outfit of one of the soldiers he knocked out. Combine that with bad cliches, like “The walking in on him kissing the secretary”, which is completely pointless as it will have no impact on their relationship whatsoever and only the most braindead neanderthal would think it would deter their eventual coupling.

Love the Captain America Blu-Ray and love the quote on the DVD cover... "The best superhero movie ever” (Brian Erdy, CBS-TV), certainly better than Batman Begins.

As usual, Marvel doing whatever it can to whore its product out.

You say whore like that's a bad thing. I love the right whore!

Cap edges this one for me, it's slicker, more stylish and has more overall depth than Batman Begins and that's without factoring in the age gap between the two. Cap just has more going for it than the slower paced Batman.

JRM
JRM

No way is Captan America better than Batman Begins. Captain America isn't a very interesting character and that alone should rank it below Begins without having to mention everything else Batman does better.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/Wolvie09/news/?a=49715 "Captain America is a Sales Hero... Home Video Sales Chart Sets Blu-ray Marketshare Record!" Oh, that's gotta hurt those haters!

I think Captain America tops Batman Begins for me. Yes, Batman Begins was a success that allowed Nolan to bring out The Dark Knight which was a very successful and acclaimed film. However, unlike Captain America, it just doesn't have the strength and charm that Captain America has. Captain America is not just a stand-alone movie. It's a part of the Avengers that is coming out in 2012, which may I add, has had years and years of planning. Whereas Batman solely relies on the fact that 'it's Batman', Captain America suits both casual and hardcore fans of the comics. To date, most of the Marvel movies (Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk) are officially tied into a canon universe that will come into fruition in 2012. If you were not captivated by the other Marvel movies, you can watch Captain America as a stand-alone title and still have a great time. Captain America also is a break-away from the gritty and edgy comic book movies that have dominated the cinemas during the 2000s. It doesn't poke fun at the fact that there are costumed vigilantes fighting because of some tragic origin, it's about an honest-to-down-good guy who has given the opportunity to serve his country. It's refreshing and is not afraid of prancing it's colors on the screen.

It's been ages since I watched Begins, and when I did it was while I was in the midst of doing laundry and pretending to study. So, yeah, not very clear memories of it and I can't say with any certainty that I liked Captain America better than it. However, I have to take issue with all these assertions that Steve Rogers is not an interesting character, boring because of his very goodness. As much as I want complex characterization, I also occasionally like to see someone up on the screen who is flat-out good and admirable. I know this isn't something that is looked well upon in our postmodern world, but I sometimes get tired of all these dark figures battling inner demons.

Both are in my top 100 but Batman Begins does it for me. I see a much more complex character in Bruce Wayne and see much more of a character arc in his development. Nolan did a brilliant job of bringing what could have been a very cheesy character (Think Tim Burton) to a very gritty world

Is Batman Begins a "better" movie, per se....sure. But the Cap is more entertaining...so I'll go with the Avenger.

Captain America: The First Avenger and Batman Begins fall into the same genre but they're two different viewing experiences. I enjoy both, but Batman Begins left me breathless by the credits. You do not have to be a comic book reader or even a fan of superhero movies to love it. I'm not so sure about Captain America. It's a solid entertainment for sure, but I feel its obligation to its fan base at times took over its storytelling. That being said, seeing the film turned me into a fan of Captain America whereas before I had only seen bits and pieces of the caped icon. By contrast, Batman Begins showed me a side of a superhero I thought I knew and gave me a brand new experience at the movies. Captain America is a well-constructed origin story, but it follows a formula that at times felt a little familiar. Batman Begins is an origin story too, but I never felt that Nolan was saving all of his tricks for a later movie. I feel that is the reason The Dark Knight was so successful. Had Batman Begins been a strictly business origin story and not the stand alone film it is, the surprise of The Dark Knight would not have been as unexpected. With these films, Nolan has given audiences two heaping spoonfulls of the Batman legend. Captain America at times feels like the appetizer before the main course that is (or hopefully will be) The Avengers.

Batman Begins is far, far superior. Why someone would even have to think about this matchup is beyond me.

I kinda enjoyed CA but I enjoyed BB more although I don't think it's as good as everyone says it is,but the dark knight is a masterpeice.

I don't understand why people dislike Christopher Nolan so much. He hasn't made a bad movie and just continues to make great movies after great movies. This is not a debate BB wins hands down CA is like a 7 where as BB is more of an 8-8.2

Captain America is half of a good film. Batman Begins, though I feel it's overrated, is far superior.

I stand by my defense of the Cap as a character. But I just watched Batman Begins and it's a better film, due to the writing, direction, and performances. I'm glad I gave it a second chance. One of the better superhero movies, and not just set-up for TDK.

theres a diffrence between fun superhero movie than deep character study. for me when seeing captain america, i was in the theater very entertained and the story was really straight foward. it had everything i wanted in a marvel movie. for me when seeing Batman Begins. it was very complex and it certainly made me think way more about whats going on in the movie than just entertaining me with explosions laughs and colors. Batman Begins is more for the film critic when Captain America is more for the fanboy which u can call me both.

Captain America is just a better all around movie. It has more heart and is way more fun. I never understood why anyone thinks anything about Batman Begins is complex.

Batman Begins easily wins this. Captain America was so boring and shitty, i the 8 o clock show on opening day with 15 people. The two guys with Captain America shields enjoyed the movie and thats it lol.

I enjoyed Captain America more

I like both, but I think Batman Begins is not only the best origins story, but arguably the best superhero film of the lot. I should be clear on this, that although I've rated TDK higher, I regard TDK as more of a social commentary on terrorism and anarchy with superheroes in it, rather than a pure superhero film, whereas BB focuses solely on the birth of the caped crusader himself. To say that BB doesn't stand up on it's own is being really harsh at best; I think it works perfectly well on its own and then some. Don't get me wrong though, while I like Nolan's films I don't consider myself a Nolanite, and I'll be the first to admit that the film has problems; the editing is atrocious, particularly in the fight scenes (it looks like a 12-year old Youtuber cut the film together on Windows Movie Maker while hooked up to an IV full of Lucozade), and while Wally Pfister's cinematography can be breathtaking in some scenes (as in all his movies), the combined camera work and editing in most of the action sequences would make Paul Greengrass's stomach churn. I also think that Scarecrow, one of the best villains in the Batman universe IMO, gets shafted in favour of Ra's al Ghul's new world order plan, which while morally interesting is technically ludicrous for a film which takes its "superhero science" seriously; "focused microwaves to vapourise the water supply" (and surely every human being in Gotham turned to a dry husk, thus negating the use of fear gas?), not to mention setting up for the arguably even more problematic motivation in TDKR. But as a film about Batman, I still think it's a fantastic turn for the better, and an admirable film in it's own right. Captain America was more in the "better than I expected, but not as good as it could have been" category, and feels less like a good standalone film and more like another segue to the Avengers film, but playing it much safer. It's as if Marvel had already said "yep, Iron Man worked, project Avengers is a go. Get the next few out production line style", which sounds worse than it is, but I feel that Captain America still doesn't stand up on its own, particularly in comparison to Iron Man. So Captain America was fun, but Batman Begins was a much higher calibre by far.

Batman wins with ease.

Batman Begins is the more complete and captivating work. Nolan is a far better director than Joe Johnston.

Captain America delivers the more captivating film and is FAR more entertaining. Easy call here.

Not only is Batman Begins a fantastic blockbuster/comic book movie; it was the first comic book film to transcend the genre and reach that status of truly great film. Captain America is a lot of fun, but it's definitely not in the same league as Nolan's groundbreaking achievement.

Excellent films. Tough call but The Captain felt too much like Raiders of The Lost Ark not to vote for it.

Oh please, BB is miles better. MILES!!!

Batman Begins is the far superior film, in my mind.

Oh please, BB is miles better. MILES!!!

Easily Batman.

Cap was an exciting, enjoyable adventure film and Batman Begins was boring. I almost felt like Nolan had some script lying around that he managed to shoehorn Batman into. It wasn't even recognizably a Batman movie to me. Personally, I pretty much can't stand when I feel the exposition of a film and Nolan must be the most exposition heavy director in the history of cinema. Watching his films makes me feel like screaming at the screen, "I got it already! I know! I'm not stupid Why are you explaining such obvious bullshit?!? I knew that already! Get on with it!" This match-up isn't even close.

Cap was an exciting, enjoyable adventure film and Batman Begins was boring. I almost felt like Nolan had some script lying around that he managed to shoehorn Batman into. It wasn't even recognizably a Batman movie to me. Personally, I pretty much can't stand when I feel the exposition of a film and Nolan must be the most exposition heavy director in the history of cinema. Watching his films makes me feel like screaming at the screen, "I got it already! I know! I'm not stupid Why are you explaining such obvious bullshit?!? I knew that already! Get on with it!" This match-up isn't even close.

"Nolan must be the most exposition heavy director in the history of cinema." Well, I think it's his writing that's at fault in this regard. I don't know if there's any other auteur of widespread acclaim, or at least moderate acclaim, that trumps him. Interesting test. Spielberg is very heavy-handed, but he's all about excessive emotion. Lucas is maybe just clumsy all around. There's a lot of Asia that makes Nolan look downright subtle, but I wouldn't have called those dudes acclaimed. Hmmm, I need to think about this. (But, yeah, BB still mollywhops Captain Murica.)

Maybe Cameron, on occasion?

The thing about Nolan versus Spielberg, Lucas or Cameron in terms of exposition is that the very structure and raison d'etre of many of his films are expository in nature. It's not just the dialog. Compared to him, the other three directors are much more straight forward even while they hold your hand like Uncle Steve, George and James. To their credit though, there is a tactile and emotional intimacy in their hand holding that is almost entirely absent from Nolan's work.

I really liked Cap, but c'mon it's really not close Batman

I'm a fan of both, but overall Batman Begins is a better film

Can't we just all get along?

I really like Captain America and I can't wait for the sequel, but BB is far better.

Id have to Side Batman Begins .... I do like the darker feel of the batman movies and the conflict/villians are more interesting in Begins than Captain America

"I do everything he does just slower." Steve over Bruce.

Well I actually fell asleep the only time I tried to watch the first captain america.

Captain America wins in a walk especially now that the character has validated with three additional superior films.

"Well I actually fell asleep the only time I tried to watch the first captain america." Not surprising, considering the FACT that Steve Rogers has the most boring, one-dimensional origin of any fictional character to be put to pen & paper... and keyboard. Any adaptation of his "development" was going to be lackluster, especially compared to the textured, nuanced depth that a character like Batman provides. Nolan's Origin story is an vast on an already interesting character, whereas CA is just a copy/paste job of a character who's journey can be told in full on a comic of Bazooka Joe. Batman Begins curbstomps.

"I do everything he does just slower." Steve still over Bruce.

Don't like either very much but Batman Begins still wins by several miles.

Definitely Batman Begins for me.

Captain America wins in a walk especially now that the character has validated with three additional superior films.

Batman Begins, the greatest origin film to bookend the greatest trilogy of the 21st century. It's been regarded as an instant innovative classic for over a decade for too many reasons to count. It's phenomenal impact on the direction of modern cinema extends further than the Avengers franchise and even the entire LOTR trilogy.

Affleck is about to make everyone forget Bale. That's a fact.

Evans is so bland, he doesn't even need another person in the role to make people forget about him.

What's with all the sour talk here?

I know there is a great deal of critics and everyday film goers, like me, who can't help but hold all other films, from independent shoestring to billion dollar blockbusters, to the new standard that Nolan has set now and for the foreseeable future. It seems impossible and increasingly futile to judge other films on their own merit when Nolan keeps coming back every couple of years to produce yet another timeless mastercraft to revolutionize the industry and raise the quality standard to unprecedented heights, to the point that it's so difficult for other directors, young and old, to keep up, and their respective bodies of work look and feel so empty and hollow in retospect. It's akin to witnessing the awe-inspiring beauty of DaVinci's Mona Lisa, then watching a gaggle of preschoolers stick their crudely colored scribbles on the wall next to it; they simply pale in comparison. Nolan's transcendent body of work has done just that to the film industry. Batman Begins, a mere 1/9th of his directorial resume, managed to have an impact on the direction of filmmaking/storytelling that even a trilogy of billion dollar grossers set in Middle Earth were unable to match. Interstellar's groundbreaking craft had some of the most acclaimed directors outside of Nolan gushing like schoolgirls at how he was able to bring the art of storytelling to levels yet to be fully comprehended. Unfortunately, fanbases of these directors have become so bitter and resentful at the sheer effortless way Nolan has leapfrogged the rest of the industry, in such a relatively sort time, that they lash out using poorly thought out logic that is a toxic combination of desperately reaching rationals, hypocritical comparisons, and even a basic lack of rudimentary math skills. Everyone is, understandably, rushing to become the next Nolan, but ultimately failing to measure up due to taking shortcuts or simply not being able to see/comprehend the intricate nuances that are so skillfully employed in Nolan's works. So while some films are more successful (James Bond, X-Men, Planet of the Apes, Star Trek) than others (XMO:Wolverine, Terminator Salvation), they all ultimately fail to live up to the expectations that viewers may be, unfairly, measuring them to. In many ways, unless you're Christopher Nolan, it's a bad time to be a filmmaker right now.

Both are shit but in the end, who is cooler? Batman or Captain America? No contest.

A reminder of how great origins films are suppose to be done. Why can't the DCEU get anything right? Time to beg Nolan to come back and come home????????

Batman Begins (9.5/10) > First Avenger (4/10) The Dark Knight (10/10) > Winter Soldier (8/10) The Dark Knight Rises (8/10) > Civil War (7.5/10) A consensus clean sweep victory for the Nolan trilogy!

The Captain for me.

Batman Begins by a long way. Superb film vs average film

i like how everyone here trashes nolan so much about him being `oveRrAtEd' that now he's actually underrated here smh

After all Squaremasters crying and bitching about Marvel being the greatest franchise ever made and how they all suck, he goes ahead and contradicts himself by praising Winter Soldier & Civil War. Your “Copy & Paste” comments are a joke & I love a good laugh.

Marvel is nowhere near the best franchise ever made. Batman Begins is way better than The First Avenger

First Avenger outclasses Begins by at least a factor of ten.

TFA is so corny how did it even get a 80% on RT. BB destroys

It only has a 7.00 out of 10 average ratings.

Both great origin movies, but BB is the second best superhero movie ever made. Not to undermined TFA, but it just can't stand to BB.

This is actually a controversial match? Like, I think the First Avenger is fine and all, but Batman Begins is one of the best superhero films of all time, and one of my all time favourite films. The Red Skull is an okay villian; Scarecrow is a brilliant and creepy Antagonist (through the main villian, Ras Ahl Ghul, is a little blah). Captain America is okay as the hero; Bruce is incredible as the (flawed) protagnist. The film has a much better story, better usage of its locations, better acting, better characters, a darker tone, better editing, it's just so much better. I'm not a Marvel hater in any way - the Winter Soldier is one of my favourite films and would be a much closer match-up with Begins. But as is, Begins wins this round by a landslide

any nolan movies (yes even insomnia) beats TFA by a landslide

Batman begins is the best superhero origin movie ever, completely outclasses first avenger, or any marvel movies easily

Batman begins is the best superhero origin movie ever, completely outclasses first avenger, or any marvel movies easily

Without question Captain America delivered the better movie here and the better trilogy. As if any sane person is saying otherwise in the real world. LoL.

TFA is overrated as hell, BB by a landslide

I actually think TFA is slightly underrated, but still: BB is pretty much what I think of when I think of a good superhero origin story.

as bad as captain american was but batman begins is farther far good is still it is

Despite Batman Begins, in my opinion, being the weakest of the trilogy I still hold it in higher regard than Captain America: The First Avenger. I think Nolan's directing creating what is simply are darker and more compelling tone to the entire film.

After reading every comment here, all I can say is: SquareMaster is a giant Nolan fanboy, my god. But I can at least agree that Batman Begins is better on literally every level. Here's the thing, a film should not just be entertaining. Even a garbage movie can entertain you without being even halfway decent. A movie should be technically solid, have a tight and well written script, connect with the viewer on a deeper intellectual/emotional level, and obviously entertain them. A film that does all four of those is a great film. Batman Begins is a solid movie technically (albeit the editing is extremely flawed and does harm the cinematography at times), the script is well written and fairly tight apart form that whole 3rd act, the film, personally, connected quite a bit with me emotionally (which I'll get into later), and it was extremely entertaining, and possibly more entertaining than even its far better sequel. Like I said earlier with it connecting to me, this was during a time in which I was kind of lost. I was more or less trying to find a place to fit in and thrive, to grow and become better. This movie and specifically Bruce's journey resonated with me quite a lot because of that. The themes, character development, etc. all worked for me and even the weaknesses were fairly easy to ignore because of that. If I was to nitpick at every single thing, then Batman Begins would be like a 6/10, but I give it an 8/10 simply because of how much it resonated. Captain America, on the other hand, didn't. I liked it. It was fun, but it didn't get that same feeling that Begins did. So yeah, Begins here

are ppl just blind in this site or what???? squaremaster is no saint but someone look at avenger7 doing the same thing but WITH 10 ALTS???????? and they all ignore it???? WHY????